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Thread: Why there's no paratroopers

  1. #1
    Forum Conscript Dogma One's Avatar
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    Why there's no paratroopers

    Major H

    I recently brought TACOP4 and I love it.

    I want to ask you a question: Why there's no paratroopers/SF team (that can be air drop)

    I would love to have this option in order to "air-drop" platoon or company of 82nd or 101st anywhere I wish to "drop" them. (with with their equipment/light vehicles such as wheel-based armored vehicle)

    I think its a best way to confusing them/disrupt their battle plan or taking an initiative to seize the objective(s) in order to prevent OPFOR to taking an initiative before we do.

    Marine Force Recon/Navy Seal (to air-drop them) on specfic spot where I wish them to probe/recon. They also can acting as FO, foward observer. Once when they detected of their (OPFOR) movement, I will know which AoA, avenue of approach, they are going to use.

    I don't like the idea to using BFV (Bradley Fighting Vehicle) w/scout element or light infantry all way to the "position" where I wish them to establish the OP (Observation Post)

    Its taking some time to reach the "position" where I wish them to establish the OP. (with BFVs or wheel-based armored vehicles)

    I, as TACOP commander, need another solution(s) to get there fast, and get out fast if they detect a large formation of armored vehicles or AoA

    Any idea, Major?

    Dogma One, out.

  2. #2
    Forum Conscript dhuffjr's Avatar
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    Air drops are on the wish list. In the guided development folder I think there is a discussion of this. While it take time to drive forward to the desired observer location or even fly forward in a helo. It would be more survivable than a large transport flying across the FLOB in a meeting engagement scenerio.

    Some ideas for you.
    • If your playing solitare against the AI you could use the add one unit feature to "insert" the FO/sniper/recon team to the desired "hide" location.
    • You can do this in a PBEM game as well but only in the initial setup at the agreement of both players.

  3. #3
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    That has been on the wish list for a long time. It hasn't had a work priority because para capablity hasn't been used much since WWII.

    Anyone have examples of actual parachute use in the last twenty or thirty years as described by Dogma One?

  4. #4
    Chief Defender of the Faith ADMIN Dr Zaius's Avatar
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    There haven't been many airborne operations by non-special ops units since WWII. A small number of Rangers dropped on Grenada. There was also an airborne drop in the invasion of Panama. Neither of these resulted in fierce battles.

    I also think there was at least one airborne operation in Vietnam, but it was quite limited. Anyone have any info on that?

    I doubt we will ever see another "mass tactical" involving a large portion of the 82nd Airborne. SAMS have changed the equation a bit.
    "I have always known about man. From the evidence, I believe his wisdom must walk hand and hand with his idiocy. His emotions must rule his brain. He must be a warlike creature who gives battle to everything around him, even himself." - Dr. Zaius

  5. #5
    Forum Conscript dhuffjr's Avatar
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    I would not expect to see platoons or companies airdropped alone, but there is room in the future for ops with say a battalion drop or maybe two.

    I've got an idea or two for a modern Inchon Landing scenerio for a mother of all PBEM game or maybe and MBX/CPX style game. I was going to have the paratroopers in plane loads and then come up with some forumula for aircraft survivability and then have the umpire or player in a PBEM game land them with some sort of dispersal as determined by some other formula.

    Division drop....never.
    Brigade drop.....not likely.
    Battalion or two drop....probably.

    Worthy for being on the list, for the WWII scenerios and for modern third world actions, IMHO.

  6. #6
    Forum Conscript Dogma One's Avatar
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    Here it is, Major.

    April 11, 2003

    Commander recounts historic C-17 airdrop into Iraq
    By Cynthia Bauer
    Air Mobility Command Public Affairs

    SCOTT AIR FORCE BASE, Ill. (AMCNS) -- It was by any measure a landmark moment for airlift operations and the C-17 Globemaster III. The nighttime airdrop last month of 1,000 "Sky Soldiers" from the 173rd Airborne Brigade behind enemy lines into Northern Iraq was the largest combat airdrop since the invasion of Panama in December 1989 for Operation Just Cause and a first for the C-17.

    However, it wasn't just this moment in support of Operation Iraqi Freedom that made history, but also the heroic efforts of active duty and Reserve aircrews and maintainers, and outstanding teamwork by the Army, Air Force and Navy. That's according to Col. Bob Allardice, the 62nd Airlift Wing commander at McChord AFB, Wash., and mission commander for this operation.

    He, along with Army Col. William Mayville of the 173rd Airborne Brigade, led the operations for 62 airlift missions over five nights to bring a full Army brigade from Aviano Air Base, Italy, into Northern Iraq. A fleet of C-17s delivered more than 400 vehicles, more than 2,000 people, and more than 3,000 short tons of equipment. All arrived on time, all without mishap, with great precision, despite launching four aircraft per hour for nighttime landings.

    "People kept saying 'nobody's in the north'," said the 44-year-old commander. "The next day, there were 1,000 combat troops on the ground in the north. And within a couple more days, there was a full brigade on the ground. Who could do that?"

    Only the U.S. military and the combined efforts of all those who touched the mission: planners, aerial port personnel, pilots, Air Force and Navy fighter escorts, aerial refuelers, loadmasters, jump masters, combat communications personnel. Colonel Allardice said it was all the soldiers and airmen who've been training for years and who had the dedication to make it happen.

    "We had 89 maintainers who launched over a squadron's worth of jets every single day in a very short period of time, with 100 percent reliability ... I briefed them on what our mission was early on (and told them) 'what I require of you is every single day, I need 100 percent aircraft generation. I can't have a single airplane not make it. I need that from you.' And they gave it to me," he said.

    In addition to the soldiers of the 173rd, 20 airmen of the 86th Contingency Response Group from Ramstein Air Base, Germany, also parachuted into Iraq that night. They comprised a team of specialists from the intelligence, medical, communications, security, aerial port, engineer and fuels career fields who helped prepare the airfield for use by U.S. forces.

    The colonel recalled the events leading to the March 26 airdrop. An important issue for the planners was the threat of hostile fire.

    "If you think about it in retrospect, we were flying a large formation into Northern Iraq, hostile airspace. We were escorted by the fighters, but still in hostile airspace," he said.

    The colonel said the planners addressed the threat during briefings going through a number of possible "what if" scenarios. The planners also hammered out more than 140 possible routes that could be flown into Iraq.

    Colonel Allardice was in the lead aircraft of the formation of 15 C-17s. As the lead jet taxied down the ramp, he looked out the window and noticed something amazing happening on the ramp at Aviano, home of the 31st Fighter Wing. Even though the air and ground crews tried to maintain a low profile days before the launch, the base woke up that day to thousands of Army troops and 17 aircraft on the ramp. People there knew something big was about to happen.

    "There were four airplanes behind me and 10 others lining up at the taxiway. To see this huge formation on the ground with people everywhere . there were people on the rooftops, lining the streets, with American flags waving. They understood something big was happening, and that they were part of some very large historic moment. This was so large and so many people (had a part) in this operation, they all felt they were part of it. That's what you want. You want every airman to know they are connected to the mission."

    Once in flight, the situation became a little tense for the aircrews from McChord AFB and Charleston AFB, S.C., as reports of bad weather conditions threatened the mission. But, the colonel said, even so, the mission continued.

    "The weather was bad when we took off, and the weather was bad two hours out. But based on the forecast and based on the winds, I was convinced the weather would be good when we got there (to the drop zone)," he said.

    With fixed determination, the C-17 aircrews pressed ahead ready for the challenges of not only that night's airdrop, but also the next four nights that required nighttime landings on an unimproved airstrip with no lighting. Because the operations were at night, Night Vision Goggles were essential. Once reserved only for special operations, NVGs are now a mainstay for the C-17 aircrews. It was the use of these special goggles that allowed the aircraft to virtually sneak in and out of the area.

    The colonel said that while there are so many things that could go wrong behind the scenes, it's "extraordinary airmen conquering the impossible who make a mission like this successful.

    "It's not when everything goes right, it's when the impossible presents itself and you have professionals who safely attack the problem to taxi on time, to take off on time, to get the job done," he said. "That is why I love this mission: To see the pride, professionalism and enthusiasm to accomplish the mission regardless of circumstances."

    He said that in many ways the situation in Afghanistan the year before prepared the troops for this one, in the procedures used to integrate with all the other airborne assets. Colonel Allardice also served as the mission commander for the nighttime high-altitude airdrop mission just over 18 months ago to deliver 2.4 million Humanitarian Daily Rations into Afghanistan.

    "Remember in Afghanistan we crossed the forward edge of battle the first night. It was the first time the C-17 had done that, the first time the C-17 had been employed in combat. Then we were new, raw recruits to that world, so we learned those lessons in Afghanistan through trial and error. This time, we walked in with a much better perspective on what was going to be expected. We were able to plan early on much more deliberately. And we had a great connection with the people who build the Air Tasking Order, which is the guide for all air assets. It's historic, too, that we were fully integrated from the very beginning with the entire air package."

    The missions were made possible by almost three dozen aerial refuelings, the tireless efforts of airmen with the host wing air mobility squadron, and Air Force and Navy fighter escorts. And there was not one part of the Air Mobility system that wasn't touched during the operation. In addition to delivering forces and equipment, the C-17s also evacuated several wounded soldiers for care in Germany.

    "We used every capability you could imagine with the C-17 to do something no other nation in the world could ever bring about. And we did it with a 100 percent success rate. America's getting our money's worth out of this jet," he said.

    Dogma one, out.

  7. #7
    Forum Conscript Dogma One's Avatar
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    http://www.173rdairborne.com/manifest-iraq.htm

    OPERATION NORTHERN DELAY

    .

    Department of the Army, HQs, 173d Airborne Brigade, Unit 31401, Box 88, APO, AE 09630

    Permanent Orders 145-19 24 May 2004

    Announcement is made of the following award:

    Award: Bronze Star Combat Parachutist Badge and the Award: Arrow Head Device

    Dates(s) or period of service: 26 1700Z March 2003 to 26 17737 March 2003 at Bashur Drop Zone Northern Iraq

    Authority: AR 600-8-22, paragraph 7-25, Approval Authority dated 29 May 2004

    Reason: For participation in a parachute assault landing into enemy controlled territory.

    Format: 320 FOR THE COMMANDER:

    10 Chalks = 969 Jumpers
    Last edited by Dogma One; 10 Jun 06 at 21:53.

  8. #8
    Forum Conscript Dogma One's Avatar
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    I just want to add one more thing...<grin>

    Here it is

    NORTHERN PRESENCE BOLSTERED

    The operation that put a 1,000 U.S. paratroopers in northern Iraq, labeled the largest U.S. jump since the invasion of Panama in 1989, raised by six times the number of American forces in the Kurdish enclave and seemed a harbinger of a much bigger presence to come.

    The soldiers, mostly members of the Army's 173rd Airborne Brigade, based in Vicenza, Italy, included rifle companies, platoons armed with mortars and anti- tank missiles, engineers for clearing mines, sniper teams, long-range surveillance teams, Air Force ground teams and humvees equipped with missiles and .50-caliber machine guns.

    Officers said they would be reinforced with heavy weapons and more equipment and troops in the next few days.

    The airstrip site is outside the town of Bashur, about 30 miles northeast of the city of Irbil and 30 miles south of the Turkish border.

    For now, the only way U.S. soldiers can be inserted into northern Iraq is by air. Turkey refused Bush administration requests that its territory serve as a staging ground for the 4th Infantry Division, whose 62,000 troops are now headed for Kuwait to join allied forces in southern Iraq.

    The growing American footprint in the north should discourage Turkey from moving significant numbers of troops into the region. Ankara fears that Kurdish politicians in the north may try to establish an independent state there after the war, which could reignite ethnic Kurdish nationalism in Turkey.

    Since the war began, U.S. warplanes have been bombing Iraqi positions in the oil-rich northern cities of Mosul and Kirkuk, all the while fielding complaints from the impatient Kurds that the effort is doing little damage to Hussein's forces.

    The Americans would have to bulk up significantly to be able to pose a ground challenge in the north. The Iraqis are believed to have 120,000 troops there, including Republican Guard units and suicide squads.

    Exactly what was happening on the central and southern fronts was still unclear.

    In the morning, alarming reports said large numbers of Iraqi Republican Guard troops and vehicles were heading out of Baghdad and toward the U.S. 3rd Infantry Division. The stage was seemingly being set for a major battle in the Euphrates Valley that would be a critical test for both militaries.

    But top officials at the Pentagon and at Central Command headquarters in Qatar said later that the threat was exaggerated and that the initial reports were based on inaccurate intelligence.

    Gen. Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said of the Iraqis forces, "We don't believe they are armored vehicles. They are light vehicles of some sort." He added that they were "being engaged as we find them. "

    The Washington Post was alone in reporting that most of a convoy of several hundred Iraqi vehicles believed to be ferrying Republican Guard soldiers toward elements of the U.S. Army's 3rd Infantry Division near Karbala, about 50 miles south of Baghdad, had been wiped out by American air strikes.

  9. #9
    Forum Conscript dhuffjr's Avatar
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    How did I forget about the Northern Iraq operation?????
    Another good example of smaller scale use of airborne troops. Much of the vehicle/follow on force was air landed though.

    Currently we can game from a period shortly after the landing but not the landing itself. Reality is if the landing itself was eventful ie contested it would not be much fun for the airborne side watching their forces get hosed.

  10. #10
    Forum Regular jthomas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhuffjr
    Currently we can game from a period shortly after the landing but not the landing itself. Reality is if the landing itself was eventful ie contested it would not be much fun for the airborne side watching their forces get hosed.
    I think this is a good point. Unless you're gaming something like the landing on Crete, or contested drop zones in Market Garden (both of which, I believe, are beyond the scope of TacOps), a paradrop is probably most easily simulated by dispersion of initial deployment zones, plus some kind of supply/readiness penalty- until the landing player has been able to consolidate.

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